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Questions and Answers
Since
the release of 'Gateway to Atlantis' a lot of people have asked Andrew
questions about how he arrived at his conclusion.
Below are answers to these, this page will be updated when new questions
arrive.
From Peter Lund:
"I thought Plato said it was as big as Libya and Asia together. What the heck have YOU been reading?"
Andrew Collins replies:
According to modern translations of Plato’s Timaeus and Critias, Plato did indeed state that Atlantis was the size of Libya and Asia together. However, a landmass of this size is so large that it would not even fit within the Atlantic Ocean (there is no reason to assume that Plato really meant just Asia Minor, modern Turkey, as some have suggested when he said Asia). Moreover, in the Critias Plato describes the topography of Atlantis’ central island, including its great plain, mountain ranges and precipitous cliffs that come right down to the sea. As you will see from the TRUE LOCATION section of the website, there is every reason to suppose that he was describing an island that could have been as little as 600 by 400 kilometres in size. If this was the case, the idea voiced elsewhere in his dialogues that Atlantis was the size of Libya and Asia together makes no sense. Even Ignatius Donnelly in his 1882 classic ATLANTIS: THE ANTEDILUVIAN WORLD must have realised that something was wrong, for in his own translation of the Critias he seems to imply that the great size of Atlantis refers to the EXTENT of the Atlantean Empire of islands and NOT to the size of the landmass.
There is no geological evidence whatsoever to suggest that an `island’ the size of Libya and Asia combined ever existed in the Atlantic Ocean. Even the Azorean or Mid-Atlantic landmass proposed by Donnelly, Chris O’Brien, German scientist Otto Muck and Russian scholar Nikolai Zhirov would have been just a fraction of this size. It therefore makes more sense to conclude that in referring to Atlantis being the size of Libya and Asia together Plato was in fact referring to the extent over which the Atlantean Empire was thought to hold sway. Moreover, that the main island, on which the plain was located, was much smaller by comparison. From the evidence presented by Plato, Professor Emilio Spedicato of Bergamo University has identified this island as Hispaniola. I identify it with Cuba, the largest existing island on the western Atlantic seaboard. In geological terms, only these islands make any sense of the evidence provided by Plato.
From Don
"Dear Andrew:
A friend forwarded your website and letter to me which you posted and you asked for comments....well, here are some and I do hope you are not offended. Firstly, with all due respect to you and your research...I feel that your theory on Cuba, etc. being what Plato and others through the ages is certainly not in accord with what some of the sages state... Bear with me...I am not a researcher, nor hold degrees in such subjects, but an interested soul in the theory of Atlantis as many are...
From what Plato states...Atlantis appears to be an immense civilisation and certainly one which was encompass a huge expanse and not the small group of islands you allude to..."
Andrew Collins replies:
Plato, the only classical reporter on the existence of Atlantis, never states that Atlantis was `an immense civilisation’. He merely describes its marvellous city and island empire which he placed in the Atlantic Ocean. He does state that the empire held sway over parts of the Opposite Continent, an allusion in my opinion to the American continent, and says that it tried to seize control of lands inside the Mediterranean basin. However, never does he talk about it being a civilisation, only a kingdom or empire.
"Don continues:
If one is to believe Edgar Cayce's readings...as I do...Atlantis pretty nearly covered an area from Europe to the Gulf of Mexico. One either believes Cayce or one does not...With the wealth of information, much of what appears to make sense, regarding the history of Atlantis; I would be inclined to go along with the Cayce source... In any event...I won't go into further elaboration but suggest that you research the Cayce readings extensively (unless you already have..)...to obtain a better grasp of Atlantis.. "
Andrew Collins replies:
I think you will find my coverage of Edgar Cayce and his beliefs on Atlantis presented in detail within GATEWAY TO ATLANTIS. It is up to you whether you accept that Cayce was an accurate psychic. In my own experience of working with some of the top psychics in Britain, I have found that they can be led consciously or unconsciously by existing ideas and theories. In the case of Edgar Cayce, his view that Atlantis stretched from the Bahamas and Caribbean right across to the eastern Atlantic seaboard could easily have been inspired by the works of the nineteenth-century theosophist W. Scott Elliott, or the French philologist the Abbe Brasseur de Bourbourg, or the Mayan scholar August le Plongeon or the Scottish mythologist Lewis Spence. All of them proposed that Atlantis was an enormous landmass that once stretched from the Caribbean right across to the coast of Africa before Cayce came out with his own readings to this effect.
Since we have no geological evidence whatsoever to suggest that a landmass of this sort ever existed in the Atlantic Ocean over the past 50,000 years, I feel that Cayce’s opinions have to be treated carefully, for some of what he has said makes sense (the elements regarding the Bahamas and Caribbean, for instance), while other statements are difficult to equate with known reality (i.e. the greater size of the Atlantean landmass).
It is not my intention to undermine the psychic readings of Edgar Cayce. Indeed, I feel that among his thousands of readings on Atlantis there exist interesting facts regarding lost technologies of the past. I am particularly intrigued with the concept of the Fire Stone and its links with masers, lasers and crystal technology, something that was also of interest to Nazi scientists who came across to the United States as part of Operation Paperclip following the Second World War. However, there is no historical reason to link this inspired information with Plato’s written views on Atlantis. The two are quite separate entities and should be treated as such.
"Don continues:
Please bear in mind, once more...that I do not wish to be offensive and respecting your opinion...I offer mine.. Regarding Duval whom you cite in your experiences...I too, have been in contact with him on the phone...but not recently. I find Duval to be someone who certainly might be perpetrating a hoax, as you report. I find it interesting that once when I spoke to "Duval"... - another - individual answered the phone claiming to be Duval. I, nevertheless carried on our conversation not letting him know that I was aware that this was not the "same" Duval whom I was on contact with before. To be sure this is "odd"...and heaven knows "who" is behind the "Duval" thing. Anyway, just thought I'd through that in.
Sincerely,
Don"
Andrew Collins replies:
My views on the claims of Aaron Duval and his so-called `Atlantean temples’ are dealt with thoroughly in the article entitled THE STONES OF ATLANTIS which you can view on this website.
From Wayne Ford
"Hi
I have read a number of interesting books recently which have speculated that the deaths of millions of mammoths (and other species), and in particular the suddenness of the slaughter, indicates that this was caused by the near passing of a large extra-terrestrial body, (either a comet or even another planet,) which had predictable consequences on tides and earthquakes."
Andrew Collins writes:
This is totally correct. There is every indication that around 8500 (+/- 500 years) the Western Hemisphere was devastated by a comet that broke into literally millions of fragments like some unimaginable millennial firework. It caused at least 500,000 elliptical craters across six states from New York down to Florida. Their commonality is that they are all orientated roughly north-west to south-east. They vary in size from a few hundred metres to 11 kilometres in size. Known as the Carolina Bays, they were first noticed after aerial surveys began of the Carolinas in the 1930s.
Scientists are now willing to accept that represent impact craters made by a comet, like the one which devastated the Tunguska region or Siberia in June 1908. Yet the one that caused the Carolina Bays was perhaps 100,000 times greater.
Quite obviously this would have decimated the Pleistocene megafauna of the United States and the Western Atlantic Seaboard. Indeed, aside from destroying an estimated 40 million animals in the US alone, we know that the giant sloth also disappeared from the Caribbean at the same time. Orthodox palaeontologists consider that the Pleistocene animals were hunted into extinction. So explain how this can have occurred in the Caribbean when it is equally considered that the island group was uninhabited until around 6000 BC? Something has to be wrong.
Wayne continues:
"This may even have contributed to the destruction of Atlantis, and other civilisations."
Andrew Collins replies:
It was German rocket scientist and inventor Otto Muck who first linked the Carolina Bays impact with the destruction of Atlantis in the 1950s. However, he saw Atlantis as an Azorean landmass that sunk as the tectonic plates beneath the Mid Atlantic Ridge split apart in the wake of the event. This theory I consider to have no substance whatsoever.
As I have said there is every reason to conclude that the main island of Atlantis was Cuba while the island empire was made up of the Bahamas and Caribbean, including the regions now under the sea. You can imagine that a cometary impact into the Western Atlantic would have caused one hell of a mess in the Bahamas and Caribbean. You would have seen tsunami waves 1000s of metres high. Yet when these had receded the islands would have suffered a second drowning as the melt waters from the ice sheets gradually inundated the low lying regions of the archipelagos. This took place gradually between 8000 and 3000 BC. Any human habitation on the Bahaman landmass (known today as the Great Bahama bank) would have been destroyed. This then is the Atlantis connection – preserved in the minds of the indigenous peoples of the region as catastrophe legends until the first explorers and traders from the Mediterranean world reached these islands perhaps around 2000 BC. They carried back these catastrophe stories to the ancient world, in the same way that the earliest Spanish explorers did the same during the age of Columbus.
Wayne continues:
Books dealing with the Mayans indicate that these people in particular predicted the next wave of destruction to the day!
Andrew Collins replies:
I think this might be a bit speculative, really. There is no positive evidence of this whatsoever.
Wayne continues:
This would not be possible with any event other than a very regular and predictable occurrence, such as the passing of a comet or comet-like object.
Books dealing with Sumerian history/ mythology mention the "home planet" of the original god-race of the ancient Sumerians, and appear to describe a planet which orbits our sun in an extreme elliptical orbit, similar to a comet, with an orbit-duration of about three thousand years or so.
Andrew Collins replies:
You are referring to the work of Zecharia Sitchin. Yes, there might well be a tenth (or twelfth) planet in our solar system (your Planet X). However, I do not consider it to be the `home planet’ of the gods of the Sumerians. They were born and bred on earth, I’m afraid, and are remembered in Judaeo-Christian tradition as the Watchers.
Wayne continues:
"If the Mayan's prediction are accurate, then the planet/comet will be back in about 10 years. If this is the case, surely the Hubble telescope and others should be able to see it by now?"
Andrew Collins replies:
ditto above.
Wayne continues:
"Do you have any information in this field, published or otherwise, which indicates that astronomers are actively watching for Planet X??"
Andrew Collins replies:
No I do not. However, astronomers are definitely looking out for Planet X.
Wayne continues:
"Furthermore, I read a book by Nigel Appleby which calculated the location of the Hall of Records by equating it with the "astronomical equivalent" of the star Sirius in relation to the belt of Orion. He even included photographs of the spot, which appeared to be vacant land.
This book was published in 1998. What, if anything, has been done to investigate this site further?"
Andrew Collins replies:
No. To be honest, I feel the whole idea to be flawed from start to finish. Just ask Robert Bauval.
Wayne continues:
"If nothing, why don't you form a company to purchase the land, claim to be constructing a hotel or something, and then "accidentally" discover whatever is there while excavating the foundations?
Your further correspondence would be valued."
Andrew Collins replies:
I don’t feel it necessary to waste that amount of time, money and effort. Prove me wrong and I will eat a copy of GODS OF EDEN!
From Mecca
"Hello, yes I’ve read about the Roman finds in Mexico from various news reports. They also found pottery dotted around America as well in the past. It is well known the Vikings had been around America, especially Canada long before Columbus, and the Knights Templar visited there a few years before Columbus too. Columbus actually had maps similar to the Piri Reis ones long before his famous voyage because his father in law owned a vast library of ancient maps and Columbus worked there for a time. He simply used the story of sailing to the West Indies to barter for herbs and fabrics as a pre-face to scrounge some money from the King of Spain to fund his voyage to the new world. It turned out well for both the King and Columbus as the Spanish conquered and killed the Aztecs claiming all their treasures, not to mention all the gold that was available for mining in Mexico. The king became rich and Columbus was both rich a famous. But concerning the Aztec god Quetzalcoatl who Cortes the Spanish general was mistaken for.. he is depicted as a warrior with feathers in his hair, a breastplate, a leather skirt type garment, sandals, a shield with a cross on it and was white with a beard and came from the west. What does that sound like to you? Cough *Roman*.. Romans had helmets with ruffs of feathers or dyed horse hair, wore armour, and leather skirts, had sandals and shields. the common misconception of some very ignorant orthodox historians is to ignore things like that. For instance im am 18 and living in Great Britain , in History class i was taught that Quetzalcoatl was the Aztec god and was a giant feathered serpent. This is such a pile of drivel as the Aztec's only used the feathered serpent as his symbol because the feather represented wind and the serpent water. Because Quetzalcoatl is detailed of coming to the west on a boat, probably with sails which were unheard of to the primitive peoples, maybe this is why he was associated with wind and water.. a boat with sails. Maybe he had a cross as the symbol of his legion on his shield or maybe on his sails, since he is depicted with many crosses around him in Aztec art and even in his eyes sometimes. Of course maybe he was an early Christian if the time of his arrival is post Christ, but as the crosses are not crucifix shaped this is maybe unlikely. Quetzalcoatl is written in Aztec legend as teaching the early peoples great knowledge and then leaving on a raft of serpents.. obviously more of their imagery which leads to mistranslation, he said he or his son would return one day. He was aslo said to of played a game with them called '52' which he was unbeatable at, but i cannot find any Roman games with 52 pieces or 52 squares or 52 featured in it so far. Hence the Aztecs constructed their calendar into a 52-year sacred cycle of Quetzacoatl."
Andrew Collins replies:
This calendrical cycle is derived through astronomical computations involving the constellation of the Pleiades and the planet Venus. The number 52 was important for this reason primarily. There is no reason that it should crop up in Roman culture, unless imported from the Americas.
Mecca continues:
"Amazingly Cortes landed on the 52nd year of the cycle which obviously stupefied the Aztec 'their god had returned', Cortes had a beard and a feather in his cap.. he then climbed out of the boat and planted a Cross in the ground.. obviously all these events are an amazing coincidence to Quetzalcoatl's history of 'signs' and appearance. He probably had a ship with crosses on the sails too like Columbus did. This is why he was mistaken and welcomed so warmly by the Aztecs and let into their most sacred cities and holy places with ease. When the people realised he was a fraud it was too late, and the Spanish army slaughtered the Aztecs. Obviously the Aztecs were no utopian race either they were pagans with a heavy belief in human sacrifice and slaughtered many neighbouring people. Their usual custom was to capture the enemy for sacrifice rather than kill them, which was ultimately their downfall as they were trying to disable the Spanish soldiers they were getting slaughtered themselves. But Cortes had landed in Cuba la year or so before embarking for Mexico and met an old Spanish soldier who was shipwrecked and taken in by the local tribe and could speak their language fluently. The Indian tribes knew much of the Aztecs and their customs, so im pretty sure Cortez knew of their sacred year cycles and planned at the date they would find most important. Maybe im wrong who knows. But as I see it, it looks pretty likely Quetzalcoatl was a Roman soldier who maybe was blown off course or visited the new world for some reason. Since the Olmec's are a Negroid race its pretty obvious early Africans were sailing to places like America and Australia a long time ago.
I could elaborate on this idea but i think you have many more resources at your disposal to research such things so ill leave it at that for now. Any feedback appreciated."
Andrew Collins replies:
There are many things you say in your mail, although some of the ideas regarding Columbus are very speculative. It is certain that his father-in-law left him papers, including navigational charts and details of Portuguese ventures around the African coast, although there was no known map that showed the Americas. They did, however, show legendary islands such as Antilia, although these were freely available to navigators of the period.
With respect to Cortes, I do suggest you read the chapter on this subject in GATEWAY TO ATLANTIS and then perhaps come back to me. Some of what you say is in there. You also have to be cautious about the appearances given of both Quetzalcoatl and Cortes by early Spanish chroniclers as there seems to have been some political motivation to ensure that people linked Cortes with the idea of the returning Feathered Serpent. This is another matter, the concept of the Feathered Serpent is one not unique to Mexico and could well refer to the appearance of a ruling or priestly elite who were represented in this abstract form, There was more than one feathered serpent who turned up in Mexico, and they were definitely not simply echoes of the same person.
From James A. Hartley
"An interesting website you have. I'm not totally sold on the West Indies idea, however. On the other hand, I do find it plausible - just not proven quite. On still another hand [ I'm unique in having three hands ;-)], here is a bit of minutia which you may find interesting especially as it is little known. I need to tell you a story first. I am by training an historian although I don't pursue that profession currently. I once taught ancient history at a university some years ago. Anyway, the historian in me is still quite alive otherwise I wouldn't be scrutinizing your website. Things historical engage my curiosity, especially the mysterious things. So, I keep an eye out for such unusual items.
A few years back I was doing some pleasure traveling in Wisconsin. I stayed one evening at a B&B in the small town of Lake Mills, which is about an hour or so more or less west of Milwaukee. During my stay I happened to notice a wall full of strange photos and asked what these might be about. The proprietor was more than happy to tell me all about the PYRAMIDS which lay at the bottom of the lake at Lake Mills. I can't recall the lake's name off hand but it isn't Lake Mills. It's something else even though the town straddles the lake. These photos were taken by any number of scuba divers who come to Lake Mills mainly to visit the submerged pyramids. It's a form of sport with them. And the objects certainly do look like pyramids and can't be of earth [as in earth mounds which we do indeed have around the Midwest US]. So, they must be made of stone. Maybe they are just piles of boulders too, but the photos don't suggest that at all.
What's the connection with your theory? Well, I have also wondered about the possibility of Atlantis being in the New World. I have read Critias and Timaeus also. A fascinating piece of writing for we historians of unorthodox disposition. Part of my various musings at one time argued that such a location for Atlantis would, in my mind, strongly argue for some evidence of the culture on
the nearby mainland. Any society of that stature would certainly have had at least some kind of outposting on the main body of North [and/or South] America somewhere. There are also some "technological" reasons why they might wander far inward into the continent and plant an "outpost." [Something related to earth magnetic grid line topology perhaps] Soooo..., when I discovered these pyramids existing at the bottom of some little lake in SE Wisconsin I just had to wonder about that oddity. Why in God's name were these things there? Pyramids, of all things. Or that is what some claim they found - the divers. I would have to conclude that these divers have had the best look at these artifacts so I won't second guess them from my desk chair. Plus, I have seen the photographs which these various divers have taken over time. There is something there, by golly. I got so interested in learning more about this a few years ago, I wrote the City of Lake Mills requesting more information. What I got in return was SILENCE. Nada. I understand they don't want to draw attention to this situation as it might cause all kinds of kooky people coming there in search of God knows what kinds of "wisdom." In short, Lake MIlls, Wisconsin isn't Sedona, Arizona. They like their privacy. I can even understand that.
Anyway, I thought you might find this little bit of information of some value. I guess it would be of value only if we knew the Atlanteans were into pyramid building. I don't know that they were or weren't. But somebody surely was at one time around here.
This is out of character building technique for the Indians who once lived in the region. The indigenous tribes of the midwest have built some pretty awesome earthen structures but nothing like stone pyramids, which I presume these must be being underwater as they are. One wonders if these don't actually predate the last ice age and that is why they are now at the bottom of a lake now. It would be interesting to obtain some really good information about these anomalies to determine what the hell they really are and how old. The area in question is very much proximate to the kettle moraine area of Wisconsin - glacial till and gouging action. Perhaps this is a subsidence situation of some sort or just the normal filling by water of a low spot in the topography over time. Well, that's my story. Thanks for listening."
Andrew Collins Replies:
I presume that the pyramid structures you refer to are those at the bottom of Rock Lake, Wisconsin. They exist at the bottom of a glacial lake formed some 10,000 to 11,000 years ago. They are actually made up of loose rocks piled on top of each other, rather like elongated Bronze Age cairns. Divers have reported seeing them on a number of occasions, the first being in the early 1900s shortly before World War I. Bizarrely enough, Indian tradition locally reveals that there was a lost city in the vicinity known as Atzalan, close to Aztlan. However, this curious name was only added who discovered a mounded formation east of nearby Lake Mills in 1836. He named it after the legendary Aztec homeland named Aztlan.
I can say no more on the matter, other than to say that if they are artificial in construction then they date to before the end of the last Ice Age. If so, then this is further evidence that a high culture might well have once inhabited the Cuba, Great Bahama Bank and other areas of the Caribbean prior to the Carolina Bays comet impact in c. 8500 BC (+/-500 years). Any culture that constructed the Rock Lake pyramids would probably have been decimated during the same catastrophic event.
To sum up the subject I quote Ben Whitcomb who wrote a report on the Lost Pyramids of Rock Lake for the journal skin diver in 1970 (as quoted in ANCIENT MAN: A HANDBOOK OF PUZZLING ARTIFECTS by William R. Corliss, the Sourcebook Project, 1978, pp. 204-8): ‘The pyramids are illogical. They shouldn’t be there. They would be too old, and in a place where no person could have built them, so logically they can’t exist. However, history is seldom logical, and logic or not, the pyramids of Rock Lake keeping popping out of oblivion often enough to trouble the most logical students of American prehistory.’
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